My pleasure. I love to be in service to help people with their spiritual walking.

Thank you beloved. I know how much you lovingly took care of your own father during his passing.
Jumanah

I finally was able to call Sidi in Jerusalem about praying Ya Siin and asking forgiveness for my father (who was not a Muslim) who recently passed. At first Sidi thought I was asking him to say Ya Siin for my father, and he said “Sure, I will do that.” When I asked him again if it was okay to pray Ya Siin and ask forgiveness for someone who was not a Muslim, he said, “Sure, why not.” I then asked if I could make a sacrifice on behalf of my father. He said yes and to send it to Salih Tony Kent.

You can send donations to Salih Tony Kent at: http://shaddulicenter.org/support-us/#.VTix8fnF-So

Salaams
Jumanah

Sidi’s book does not give a specific count. The Name and the Named says 114 times:
If someone has lost something, or is separated from someone dear, recitation of ya Jami’ 114 times, followed by ya Jami’ an-nasi li-yawmin la rayba fiyhi ijma’ ‘alayya dalati (“O Gatherer of humanity for a Day about which there is no doubt, bring what I have lost together with me!) helps to find that which is lost.

I am not scholar of the Qu’ran or the Hadith, so I reached out to my Sufi community to see if others had a better understanding of this subject. The following is from a beloved whose father was an imam. I felt the response was quite helpful.

Salaam Jumanah and Everyone…

This is a very important question and sensitive topic for us all to try to understand- thank you for bringing it up to the groups.
I pray that you are able to receive this with your mind and hearts open to take in the true understanding of this verse.
I am not a Scholar but have looked into this as well before and this is what i have gathered from the Qur’an and perspectives of Scholars. And so i will share with you what I learned and pray that it is relaying ALLAH swt’s meaning accurately; and ask to be pardoned if i miss anything, since it is not my intention, only from my ignorance.
In the end ALLAH swt knows the hearts, intentions and actions of HIS Creations and is EL ADL/THE JUST in what HE decides for that particular person depending on their life circumstances.

Yes, there is an ayat in the Qur’an about this, which is what i’m pretty sure the beloved was referring to you, Jumanah… and it is very important when interpreting the Qur’an to understand when the ayat was revealed and why/what is was pertaining to. Also the definition of the words used because English translations may differ slightly but that slight difference can change the overall understanding to someone.
Muslim scholars are generally of the opinion that it is not allowed for Muslims to pray for the salvation and forgiveness of non-Muslims. This opinion is based on the fact that the Qur’an has prohibited the Muslims to pray for the salvation of Polytheists in this particular time.

The Qur’an Surah is El Tawba-9, ayat 113
9:113
Literal Translation in most English Qur’ans:
It is not for the Prophet and those who have believed to ask forgiveness for the polytheists, even if they were relatives, after it has become clear to them that they are companions of Hellfire.

So… first to understand what that aya means and then the history behind it (briefly).
To start, when someone says a non-Muslim, what does that mean to you? and what is a Muslim?
Here is an excerpt from Tariq Ramadan’s book, In the Footsteps of The Prophet:

Of all messengers, the most important figure in the Last Prophet’s (Muhammad) linage is undoubtedly Abraham. There are many reasons for this, but from the outset, the Qura’an points to this partiuclar link with Abrahm through the insistent and continuous expression of pure monotheism, of human consciousness’s adherence to the divine project, of the heart’s access to His recognition and to His peace through self-giving. This is the meaning of the world Islam, which is too often translated quickly by the mere idea of submission but which also contains the twofold meaning of “peace and wholehearted self-giving.” Thus a Muslim is a human being who, throughout history- and even before the last Revelation- has wished to attain God’s peace through the wholehearted gift of him/herself to the Being. In this sense, Abraham was the deep and exemplary expression of the Muslim:

HE has chosen you, and has imposed no difficulties on you in religion. It is the religion of your father Abraham. He has named you Muslims, both before and in this (Revelation); so that the Messenger may be a witness for you (the new Muslim community), and you may be a witness for humankind.

-Surah 22; Aya 78

A “believer” is to submit to the will of THE ONE DIVINITY, THE UNITY. to not worship or submit your self/soul to any other “Gods” other than THE ONE CREATOR OF ALL THE WORLDS. (La ilaha illa ALLAH).
to believe in all of the original holy books and Prophets and Messengers that have come in history as well as the Angels.

To those who in this lifetime wanted miracles and concrete evidence of Muhammad’s prophethood, Revelation ordered him to reply, “ I am but a man like yourselves, the inspiration has come to me that your God is One God.
So whoever would hope for the meeting with his Lord – let him do righteous work and not associate in the worship of his Lord anyone.”

So this is where the word Polytheist/Pagans comes in to the surah. Most of the Polytheists that were being addressed in the time the ayat was revealed to the Prophet, were actually enemies of The Prophet and his message (in turn enemies of ALLAH swt).
Even some of the believers (followers of Jesus and Moses) deceptively planned with the Polytheists against the Prophet and his followers…which were called Hypocrites. So it was difficult to trust people. These were people that actively and violently opposed the Prophet and his people and the Faith (ONE GOD). The Prophet had made treaties and contracts with them and they betrayed him and the peace treaties that were agreed upon. and continued to create disharmony and extreme hardship for the Prophet, his follower’s lives and essentially to try to squash ALLAH and HIS wisdom/guidance for all of HIs Creation.
Yet they were still given a state of peace for 4 months (those who broke their covenants).

Another translation of the verse:

To be a faithful believer in God advocating righteousness and a sympathizer for the suffering of the souls of the dead Pagans who denied God, is to combine two attributes practically incompatible. Therefore, it is not in conformity with reason wherefore the Prophet together with those whose hearts have been touched with the divine hand make an invocatory prayer asking God’s mercy on those Pagans who died with the minds captivated in disbelief in God, even though they be of the same kin, especially after they have been assured by God that such like persons are destined to Hell.

I personally find that translation most enlightening since it doesn’t make sense to pray on behalf of someone to a God that they don’t believe in…their own belief system, life path and death beliefs don’t have anything to do with this God and HIS universal laws. They do not have a conscious connection with this God nor want to have a connection to HIM.

Another important point is that people are not judged or “destined to hell” if they did not know-did not have the information and clear signs as these people did living in the times of the Prophet and ALLAH’s revelations and miracles. these were ones that had more signs and guidance than we have today and still chose to be not only enemies and hypocrites but create harm between people causing separation.
So they still chose to be violent enemies even after it had become absolutely clear to them that Muhammad (saws) was a true prophet and messenger of God and his guidance (toward the path of Tawheed) was the true guidance of God.

The next aya goes on to say:

And Abraham prayed for his father’s forgiveness only because of a promise he had made to him.
But when it became clear to him that he was an avowed enemy to ALLAH, he dissociated himself from him; for Abraham was most compassionate and patient.

(But his father was against ALLAH swt as well as his son (Ibrahim)

The last aya:

Nor would God lead people into error after He has guided them to His path of rectitude until He has explicitly made known to them what they must avoid and they did not, God is indeed Omniscient.

This last paragraph is a summary of statement written by Moiz Amjad who has a site called Understanding Islam:

The position of the non-Muslims (as well as the Muslims) of today is quite different from those, who were the direct addressees of the Messenger.
The non-Muslims of today, in contrast to the direct addressees of the Prophet (saws), may have a genuine excuse of not accepting Islam to be the final true guidance of God or of not believing in Muhammad (saws) to be a true prophet of God. Their fate, as well as that of the Muslims of today, shall be decided by ALLAH swt, on the Day of Judgment. It is hoped, on the basis of the all encompassing mercy of ALLAH, that whoever has a real and a genuine reason of not accepting Islam , provided he had honestly searched for the truth, and had accepted and submitted to whatever he had honestly understood to be the truth, will be pardoned.
Thus, in view of the difference in the positions of the ‘non-Muslims’ of today and the ‘rejecters’ (Kaafir) of the times of the Prophet (saws), it is in my opinion that praying for the salvation and forgiveness of the non-Muslims of today shall not be against the cited verses of the Qur’an, and should, therefore, not be considered as prohibited.

Wa ALLAHU ALEM (And ALLAH knows most)

I hope that this was helpful to you Jumanah and to all the Beloveds.

Sending you all the comfort and peace of THE ONE. – Sonia

Thanks so much for this beautiful website, it’s full of love, may your heart keep being inspired to share.

On the section of prayers for the death i noticed that you mentioned to pray surah Ya-sin and do istigfar on behalf of the dying or death. However, it is my understanding that the adab with Allah is not to recite Ya-sin to non muslims and that we can do prayers for non muslims of course but we can’t ask for forgiveness on their behalf. Maybe i’m not aware if Sidi gave you a dispensation for your father?
I’ve noticed that in the belovedbeloveds group and the universities yahoo group it’s been the case that we recommend each other or request to do this two practices for our loved ones who aren’t muslim and wondering if this might be misleading the ones who are not aware of the proper adab for this two practices. And Allah knows best.

Love and blessings,

your sister rahma